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Installing Mods with BAIN.


nilmaboy
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Hi All,

Before Asking, if a thread about using Bain has been started. My humblest Apologies

I'm attempting to use This method of installing Mods for the first time I keep reading it is simple. Its only simple if you know exactly what your doing.

I'm trying to follow Tomlong75210 Guide at Tescosi.com. It is very well written, but sadly not been kept up to date,

Also done much reading of Psymons BAIN Mod installation Guide on the Bethesda Forums.Again a very well written guide, the only thing missing is a clearer explanation of creating the simplest BAIN Installer. Which would greatly help the complete novice.

Its a bit like most cook Books. To me they are very simple. Reason why. I'm a fully trained qualified Chef. But to the novice cook, these are far from simple, as they do not know the absolute Basics of Cooking. One day a chef will release such a book lol

My previous install was with a combination of Wrye Bash and OBMM.

My question is about the Mod Reclaiming SancreTor.

The esp and the 3 BSA's are all seperate 7z Zip files. Can I combine them all, creating a Bain Friendly package?

Any advice with this or any other aspect of using Bain, is very much appreciated.

Thank you for your time.

With respect.

James. :)

.

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Before you go any further, read this Wrye Bash Pictorial Guide. Probably the easiest way to explain Bash/Bain.

Don't let the term "Bain friendly package" fool you. In it's simplest form it's just a zipped file of a mod, set up so that it's ready to extract into your Data folder. You should have no issues combining RST into that. :)

Hi Hanaaisse,

Thank you very much for your reply and link to the pictorial guide.

A couple of questions please.

I should have asked in first post. Regarding the optional read me. Should I also include this in the Bain Archive, even if it is not an HTML file?

Reading the pictorial guide while asking. Installation order. In the conflicts box, when it says higher or lower, is it telling me move the archive please?

Thanks again for your help.

Much respect.

James :)

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I recommend always including the readme files in the BAIN archive. If Bash recognizes it as a readme, and it does recognize most, it will automatically install it to the Docs folder under Data for you. Very handy.

Installation order is important because mods will conflict sometimes. When they do, you use the installation order to decide which one "wins". So if you have two mods that both modify leather armour, for example, then you want to install the one with the armour style you prefer LAST, or after the other mod. Bash calls this "higher". So in the conflicts box, it lists all the conflicts for you. You want the mod that says "higher" to be the one that actually shows up in-game. If the armour you prefer doesn't say "higher", move it down in the installation order so it is installed after the other one.

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I recommend always including the readme files in the BAIN archive. If Bash recognizes it as a readme, and it does recognize most, it will automatically install it to the Docs folder under Data for you. Very handy.

Installation order is important because mods will conflict sometimes. When they do, you use the installation order to decide which one "wins". So if you have two mods that both modify leather armour, for example, then you want to install the one with the armour style you prefer LAST, or after the other mod. Bash calls this "higher". So in the conflicts box, it lists all the conflicts for you. You want the mod that says "higher" to be the one that actually shows up in-game. If the armour you prefer doesn't say "higher", move it down in the installation order so it is installed after the other one.

Hi AndalayBay.

Thank you very much for your reply and information.

I understand from my past mod installs, the rule of last installed takes over. So the same rule applies with Bain.?

I'm still sorting my Bain packages. My concern at the moment is with the latest UOP and the Update File. Readme says Install UOP, followed by the update patch. Do I leave them Both installed, or remove UOP after the update please?

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Same rule applies.

Install the UOP, then the update. Activte them both and leave them both. It was supposed to have been all incorporated into one file but the author is currently busy with Skyrim patch.

Hi Hanaisse.

Thank you again for your help.

One last question for now, give you all some peace and quiet.

I have both HGEC_Body_vdot21-15802 and EVE_HGEC_Bodystock_and_Clothing_Wrye_Bash_BAIN. Do I need to install both or just the BAIN Version please?

Feel like a complete fool having to keep asking all these questions :blush:

Is this the best place to ask, or can I also use Shoutbox.

Thank you for your time and Help.

James :cookie4u:

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Never feel foolish for asking questions! It's how we learn. :) I'm always happy to help. :cookie:

EVE_HGEC bodystock and clothing contains all HGEC body meshes, so that's the only one you need.

It's always best to create threads for drawn out or several questions, so others who may want to ask the same question might see it. There also may not be anyone in the shoutbox who can answer your question at the time.

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Hi All. Need some help again please. :help:

I've just added Mainly texture replacers to Bash Installer. But most of them are not being recognized in BAIN.

Insanity's Imperial City.

All Mythic Mods

Akatosh. Amps Cave Retexture, And Koldrons.

Will I need to use OBMM instead of Bain for these?

Any Advice is very much appreciated.

Thank you for your time.

James. :)

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You'll probably just need to repack the archives. For BAIN to recognize it, it needs a certain structure. As I said above, it needs to be easily extracted directly into the Data folder.

So, for example..

Mod A.7z

--- Meshes folder

--- Textures folder

--- Mod A.esp

--- ReadMe (not totally necessary)

Sometimes archives are zipped up with an extra folder, and that's when BAIN won't see the proper files, such as..

Mod B.7z

--- Mod B folder <------ extra folder

------ Data folder <------also not necessary

----------Mod B.esp

----------Meshes folder

----------Textures folder

So, open all those archives in a temp location and repack them. :)

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Hi Hana and AndalayBay.

Thank you both for you help. Very Much appreciated :)

Slowly all packages are becoming Bain Recognized. Now to Sort out Installation Order.

Which install order should I follow? The one in Wrye Bash, or the Tomlong installation guide?

Back too the Books lol :book:

Edited by nilmaboy
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There is also Tomlong's TESCOSI site. Here is the section on installing mods with BAIN. She has organized everything into tabs to make things easy to follow. The tab about organizing packages talks about installation order. I like the way she uses categories rather than specific mods. She does provide examples though so you know what she means by the various categories.

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Here's a better install order for you.

And always use BOSS to sort your load order afterwards. ;)

Hi Hana,

Thank you very much.. Linked bookmarked :)

There is also Tomlong's TESCOSI site. Here is the section on installing mods with BAIN. She has organized everything into tabs to make things easy to follow. The tab about organizing packages talks about installation order. I like the way she uses categories rather than specific mods. She does provide examples though so you know what she means by the various categories.

Hi AndalayBay,

Thank you very much for your help.

Been using Tomlong's Site from the beginning of this new install. Sadly some of the Photo's in the help section have not been added. Makes it unclear if I'm making errors. :(

Have questions about installer section please.

Installing UOP and the upgrade. Main goes in told that everything is correct, when trying to add update The UOP has gone Red, update yellow. I don't understand what I'm being told in the Conflicts tab. The conflict Mods have not yet been installed. Also so showing install No position with either lower or higher above each...

Am I being told I need to alter there respective install positions please?

The Only thing I'm comfortable using in Wrye is Building Bashed Patch. Somebody was kind and patient to talk me through this using Instant messaging. Long time back.

After installing QTP3R and update, is this when I should install my other Big texture replacers? I'm following the Thread on Oblivion Mods written by John for using replacers on Mid Range PC's

Again a big thank you for both taking the time to help.

With much Respect.

James. :respect:

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Installing UOP and the upgrade. Main goes in told that everything is correct, when trying to add update The UOP has gone Red, update yellow. I don't understand what I'm being told in the Conflicts tab. The conflict Mods have not yet been installed. Also so showing install No position with either lower or higher above each...

Am I being told I need to alter there respective install positions please?

No, that is perfectly normal. The UOP update will overwrite things from the UOP, that's what it's telling you. :)

Not all conflicts are bad. As long as you understand what is doing what to what your install is fine with red or yellow in the Installers tab.

After installing QTP3R and update, is this when I should install my other Big texture replacers?

Yep, go for it. Just be careful though. If you do have a mid-range PC, QTP3R is going to have an impact already so you don't want to overload with other texture replacers. What others are you adding?

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No, that is perfectly normal. The UOP update will overwrite things from the UOP, that's what it's telling you. :)

Not all conflicts are bad. As long as you understand what is doing what to what your install is fine with red or yellow in the Installers tab.

Yep, go for it. Just be careful though. If you do have a mid-range PC, QTP3R is going to have an impact already so you don't want to overload with other texture replacers. What others are you adding?

Hi Hana,

Thank you very much for your reply.

I've downloaded All the linked Mods from "John's List of Graphic Mods For Mid Range Rigs". No Installed yet. I've asked if i should use QTP3R as The Base, then add those that are linked after.

I have to be honest, finding the bain installs not so easy.

I've followed the instructions from the Wrye Bash Pictorial for creating the Bain install of DarkUI-Darn to the letter. Everything is where it is supposed to be in the Archive, But when dropping it in Bash installer, The 2 Folders both number 30 Lighter Main Menu buttons, do not show up in the Sub-Packages.

I've created Packages for The Knights of the Nine DLC. Installed fine. All green, Ran Boss, told they needed cleaning. Cleaned them all. Now all have turned Orange,All say there's 1 conflict, but nothing is said what the conflict is in the conflict box.

Installed Mods.. Are they supposed to be above or Below Last please?

The few Mods that are installed, They all have the green light after the load order is sorted by Boss. Should I just install one at a time, then run Boss after each is in? Trying to install to many at once looks like I'm asking for trouble.

There real daft thing, is with my last install with OBMM and Wrye for the bashed Patch, I had very good running game. If I were to go down the Manual install route, I understand what the readme files are saying.

Is there any reason to avoid using the New Mod install app "Nexus Mod Manager"? then use Wrye for bashed Patch, and Boss to sort out the Load order? NMM looks really simple to use.

Again thank you very much for your help, and Patience. Very much appreciated.

With Respect.

James. :flower::cookie4u: :cookie4u:

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I've downloaded All the linked Mods from "John's List of Graphic Mods For Mid Range Rigs". No Installed yet. I've asked if i should use QTP3R as The Base, then add those that are linked after.

Yes, start with QTP3R and add on from there. You'll start noticing as you add more texture replacers that you'll get more yellow/orange mods in your Installer tab. Again, this is normal as files get replaced. If you don't want a certain texture to be replaced by the next mod installed, this is when you can start moving your install order around (CTRL Up/Down arrows). Sorting the tab by Install Order is easiest to see this. If you do move mods you'll want to Anneal (right click on the mod to select) any mod you've moved and those higher and lower in the load order.

I have to be honest, finding the bain installs not so easy.

Ok, this is where I offer my best advise: Don't overthink it. It's just a tool, and you are in control. If you understand manually modding your game then you can make the tool do the same, only faster. ;)

I've followed the instructions from the Wrye Bash Pictorial for creating the Bain install of DarkUI-Darn to the letter. Everything is where it is supposed to be in the Archive, But when dropping it in Bash installer, The 2 Folders both number 30 Lighter Main Menu buttons, do not show up in the Sub-Packages.

I found it much easier to manually install Darn. If you find it easier to install the OMOD, go ahead. Not everything needs to be installed with Bain. :)

I've created Packages for The Knights of the Nine DLC. Installed fine. All green, Ran Boss, told they needed cleaning. Cleaned them all. Now all have turned Orange,All say there's 1 conflict, but nothing is said what the conflict is in the conflict box.

Because you have changed the esp. Just right click on it and select Anneal (that re-installs the missing components).

Installed Mods.. Are they supposed to be above or Below Last please?

Always above "Last"

The few Mods that are installed, They all have the green light after the load order is sorted by Boss. Should I just install one at a time, then run Boss after each is in? Trying to install to many at once looks like I'm asking for trouble.

Excellent, green is good! Again, subjective advise but it's always best to install one mod at a time, and go in game to test it!

There real daft thing, is with my last install with OBMM and Wrye for the bashed Patch, I had very good running game. If I were to go down the Manual install route, I understand what the readme files are saying.

As I said above, if you're comfortable installing some mods with OBMM or manually, that's fine. But try to use BAIN as much as possible.

Is there any reason to avoid using the New Mod install app "Nexus Mod Manager"? then use Wrye for bashed Patch, and Boss to sort out the Load order? NMM looks really simple to use.

Ah, so many opinions... not going there. I don't use it.

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I've followed the instructions from the Wrye Bash Pictorial for creating the Bain install of DarkUI-Darn to the letter. Everything is where it is supposed to be in the Archive, But when dropping it in Bash installer, The 2 Folders both number 30 Lighter Main Menu buttons, do not show up in the Sub-Packages.

Wow! I'm impressed. No seriously. That is one hard conversion. It took me a bit of fiddling to get that one to work too. There is a lot of copying around that you have to do to get that one loading properly. I think some stuff had to be replicated too, if I recall correctly. I mainly did the conversion for the exercise of doing it. I also have other mods that modify the menus, so I wanted everything in BAIN. But don't be afraid to use OBMM to install this, as Hana suggested.

Here is the sub-package list I wound up with:

10 Core Files

15 Classic Inventory

20 No 'Quest Added' Pop-ups

25 DarkUI'd Loading Screens

30 Atmospheric Loading Screens

35 Trollf Loading Screens

40 Lighter Main Menu Button Text

40 Lighter Main Menu Button Text - Daedric

If you have subpackages that aren't showing up, have a look at the directory structure below the subpackage directory.

Here are the directories that should be in the The Lighter Main Menu Button Text folder:

40 Lighter Main Menu Button Text\menus\prefabs\darn

Don't worry if you don't have all the subpackages I have. If you don't want the alternative loading screens, you don't need those subpackages. I'm pretty sure that the only reason they aren't showing up is because there's a problem with the subdirectories under the subpackage.

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Yes, start with QTP3R and add on from there. You'll start noticing as you add more texture replacers that you'll get more yellow/orange mods in your Installer tab. Again, this is normal as files get replaced. If you don't want a certain texture to be replaced by the next mod installed, this is when you can start moving your install order around (CTRL Up/Down arrows). Sorting the tab by Install Order is easiest to see this. If you do move mods you'll want to Anneal (right click on the mod to select) any mod you've moved and those higher and lower in the load order.

Ok, this is where I offer my best advise: Don't overthink it. It's just a tool, and you are in control. If you understand manually modding your game then you can make the tool do the same, only faster. ;)

I found it much easier to manually install Darn. If you find it easier to install the OMOD, go ahead. Not everything needs to be installed with Bain. :)

Because you have changed the esp. Just right click on it and select Anneal (that re-installs the missing components).

Always above "Last"

Excellent, green is good! Again, subjective advise but it's always best to install one mod at a time, and go in game to test it!

As I said above, if you're comfortable installing some mods with OBMM or manually, that's fine. But try to use BAIN as much as possible.

Ah, so many opinions... not going there. I don't use it.

Hi Hana,

Thank you very much for your reply and most valuable information. Truly Epic. :salute:

Wow! I'm impressed. No seriously. That is one hard conversion. It took me a bit of fiddling to get that one to work too. There is a lot of copying around that you have to do to get that one loading properly. I think some stuff had to be replicated too, if I recall correctly. I mainly did the conversion for the exercise of doing it. I also have other mods that modify the menus, so I wanted everything in BAIN. But don't be afraid to use OBMM to install this, as Hana suggested.

Here is the sub-package list I wound up with:

10 Core Files

15 Classic Inventory

20 No 'Quest Added' Pop-ups

25 DarkUI'd Loading Screens

30 Atmospheric Loading Screens

35 Trollf Loading Screens

40 Lighter Main Menu Button Text

40 Lighter Main Menu Button Text - Daedric

If you have subpackages that aren't showing up, have a look at the directory structure below the subpackage directory.

Here are the directories that should be in the The Lighter Main Menu Button Text folder:

40 Lighter Main Menu Button Text\menus\prefabs\darn

Don't worry if you don't have all the subpackages I have. If you don't want the alternative loading screens, you don't need those subpackages. I'm pretty sure that the only reason they aren't showing up is because there's a problem with the subdirectories under the subpackage.

Hi AndalayBay.

Thank you also for your help, very much appreciated.

Finally have the File loading correct, after checking and double checking for My error.

In the 2 missing Sub-Packages, I'd messed up the folder name's inside. Now fixed. :doh:

Minor FYI - updated that AFKMods help link since Bethesda and Nexus both had URL changes since that was written.

Hi Arthmoor,

Thank you very much for your information. Very much appreciated. :)

Too you all, again a big thank you very much, for your time and help.

Let the install fun begin lol :construction:

With Respect.

James. :pints:

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Hi All,

Progress report.

Had a major disaster. Almost completed installation, Wyre decided it was not doing anymore, along with Boss. Kept getting error message about ghosted esp's. Checked data Folder. Nearly all Ghosts.

Started Again from scratch.

Touch wood, all going well so far. Adding 1 at a time lol

A few worries at the moment.

All Big texture Replacers, Now following the rule. Which ever I want to see, Is higher in the install order. Worry with this. They are All above the UOP and its update, they are All yellow. Checking in Game, everything I want to see is being shown. Do I need to worry about the underridden files?

Have one archive, when installed, is White. "HGEC Bodyv1dot21" is the Mod. How do I get it to work properly? There's no plug-ins to activate?

Noticed just recently, When inside prison, my screen is how it should be, but soon as I leave the Sewer's There's a slight white edge around the monitor Screen. This has never happened on any other runs with Oblivion, or any other games, until now. Any Idea what could be the cause please?

Only thing different I've done is alter the 3D settings for my Graphics Card."ATI HD5700" As recommended on John's thread Graphics for mid range rigs.

Any advice is very much appreciated.

With respect.

James. :respect:

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When you say they're "above" the UOP, do yo mean visually as you look at the list, or numerically as they're numbered for package order?

The thin white edge thing is a bug in AMD's drivers relating to anti-aliasing. Something they apparently refuse to even acknowledge in bug reports. I've sent plenty only to have the reports silently tossed out with no explanation. I stopped bothering.

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When you say they're "above" the UOP, do yo mean visually as you look at the list, or numerically as they're numbered for package order?

The thin white edge thing is a bug in AMD's drivers relating to anti-aliasing. Something they apparently refuse to even acknowledge in bug reports. I've sent plenty only to have the reports silently tossed out with no explanation. I stopped bothering.

Hi Arthmoor.

Thank you for your reply.

As I'm looking at Package list in the Installers tab, Going down in package order, This is also the install order. I read if you want the files to show up, Highest install wins. The opposite of load order.

I'm probably wrong. But so far They are all showing in my testing of the game. I'm installing all my Graphics after UOP and Update. Starting with QTP3R Climbing above the "Last" Marker.

Thanks for the info on my screen. They'd soon fix the problem if happened to them. What do we know? apart from using them all day lol.

Thank you again for your help.

With respect.

James. :respect:

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Sounds like you've actually got that backward then. If you sort your insall list by package order, you want the ones with the highest numbers to be the ones you want to show up most. It should be just like how you handle load order for plugins.

It's quite possible you got away with it in this case because the package you picked don't overlap each other, or don't overlap enough to have noticed it.

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