Modding Theoretics

[Lady_Nerevar]

Its pretty safe to say that modders realize that there is a lot more to modding than just modding. Namely, that thing called "public relations" in the real world: how (and if) you advertise your mod, how people perceive it, etc. This is, I think, the single hardest part of being a modder (especially a modder with large scale projects that need public support). This thread is here to help figure it all out.

This thread is brought on largely by two things: my recent release of Hammerfell and the subsequent English release of Nehrim.

Nehrim is something of a freak phenomena - everyone in the community, including Bethesda, appears to be obsessed with it and the mod has no flaws in their eyes. It is a very good mod but we're not concerned with that. Here is their 2nd [WIPz] thread. It contains very little actual information on what the mod is about (most of the info consists of "we're doing it better than it was in Oblivion") and the screenshots (not readily accessible) must be reached through a website written entirely in German. So, what made it so wildly anticipated years before release? Was it SureAI's history (if so, what can a modder/team without 2 TC releases do to get such a positive response)? Was it the fact that they did structure it on fixing what was wrong in Oblivion, on however abstract a scale (if so, does a mod which does not seek to revamp OB's engine stand a chance)? Was it the screenshots (if so, what about them)?

In contrast, here is an early thread for my Hammerfell project. As you can see, its almost directly opposite of Nehrim's thread: I include lots of detail about the world and the mod's progress and link directly to screenshots. That thread went better than most, and even then you can see that its not quite the same outpouring of support. Obviously, the content of the mods is rather different (they ditch oblivion, I build upon it). Is that what makes a difference (i.e. people are more interested in playing a new world rather than a TES lore one)? Or was it strictly a matter of how I presented my thread (i.e. is it better to be more cryptic and pitch the mod, rather than providing lots of information and progress reports)?

Moving on, I have also been quite fascinated by the phenomenon that is Elsweyr: Deserts of Anequina. I add that subtitle there because there is another, much older, mod also called Elsweyr that got its start at the Silgrad Tower forums way back in...06? Although they did an alpha release covering vaguely what Iliana did originally, they never got much coverage and Iliana's mod is now the standard of the community when it comes to province extensions. Is this a case of the community's admiration of and fascination with lone "genius" artists (also seen in the case of Broad's Hammerfell mod, which did less than mine and had a thread posted by a 3rd party but had the whole forum excited)? Or is it a case, again, of 'better' marketing?

Out of all that, I gather these questions:

What is the role of advertising in mods? What sort of announcement thread works best? It seems to me that succinct threads with a very limited number of polished media and little or no progress updates work better than a detailed thread with tons of info and updates.

How much does the content of mods actually matter? We all like to think we pick the best mods, but it seems that at times advertisement wins out over content. What exactly does the community look for in a mod?

How does one advertise a mod with ephemeral content, such as quests? Is it enough to say "we have detailed quests that are better than Oblivion," and does doing so make you seem full of yourself?

Your questions and examples (or corollaries to my examples) are more than welcome. Your feedback is appreciated. Maybe one day we can run a Modding PR class

[Dane]

well, it seems the more RELZ you had the more interest your topics get, I find myself doing exactly the same, because if I see Lolz235t13425 (fake) or InsanitySorrow as maker of a thread you can guess which one of both I'd chose

Fails: all of my WIPZ (don't know why)

Wins: Releasing stuff, a really catchy name (Possibly not sure)

Edited September 13, 2010 by Dane

[Lady_Nerevar]

So, how can a newer modder combat this? Make releases (difficult). Its also largely cyclical: must have releases to get famous, but popular release harder if not famous. It seems like you almost have to 'accidentally' hit it big or spend a lot of time on improving your street cred.

And what makes a modder popular? Is it releases alone? Contributions to the community in general? For instance, I've been modding TES for 6+ years, but few know my name.

[Dane]

well, I'm making mods for a few months and after 3 releases nothing changes so it could be possible that I'm wrong, but I think getting a nice name, and a lot of luck are the things that count, and graphically impressing mods...

Edited September 13, 2010 by Dane

[auryga]

... For instance, I've been modding TES for 6+ years, but few know my name.

Upps? Got another impression on that .

Starting with all that modding in mid 2008, so I don't know much of the 'history' behind all the 'big' mods. Most of them I got out of the Nexus Top 100 list, so thats surely a way to get attention. Next question: how to get in there?

I prefer 'early released' mods. Even if it's only an alpha version you can see more in game than every picture or video can do. Problem is that this is true for all bad things in there too ...

And it's surely a lot luck ...

Edited September 13, 2010 by auryga

[Lady_Nerevar]

The Top 100 raises another issue: older mods will be more popular, even if they are not better. Not sure thats fixable.

[Glimiril]

Ok, a word of warning : This is my opinion, based on when I'm looking, and what grabs my attention.

Passion: First and foremost.

I want to enter another world , heck that's why I'm playing, what kind of a world I'm considering comes down to several things before I download, this world has to feel like something I want to explore, to have a character in and feel apart of it. So therefore attention to detail is important. It doesn't matter to me if the world is a bit wacky as long as there is consistency, and within that realm then it's believable. Story motivates me, a potential tale of moral decisions, where there is a possibility to play again and choose a different line, excites me, and encourages me as I then feel it can be a permanent fixture. If a mod is dealing with a story already well known or in lore, then how is their telling going to enhance my feeling of that world. I'm looking for reasons to download, as to download many, means unfinished tales, but I'll download if I feel it will enhance, add, and above all I feel passion for it.

Passion is like energy, it can be transferred, the art of getting others to get what you want them to see, is to be enthusiastic about it, a list of content can be boring without some connection to it, so videos are important these days, as a picture tells a thousand words, and many tell a story. After all video games are heavy in use of one sense, sight.

Advertisers for brands will use emotions to sell, think of that cool, crisp, chocolate ice cream, your so tempted on a hot summers day to crunch, and saviour. There you can see a simple example of emotions being played to encourage a person to think off having an ice cream, and with chocolate, what choices are there, well the commercial mentioned a name, I'll try them.

When writing something you feel you want others to share, the market is big, giving teasers can be important, again video blogs keep a feeling so fundamental to human existence, the feeling of progress and build anticipation.

Word and mouth is the ultimate seller, but it has to start some where, and passion plays the key.

A feeling of a committed project also encourages interest, as you all know.

Sometimes words like complete, overhaul, total add weight, especially when there is a feeling of wanting something more. They are only words after-all but the connection we as people make with them is important.

The fundamental difference I see between Hammerfell and Nehrim is the chance to play a different game all be it with oblivion, that for many is appealing and a chance to get away from standard races and classes. I myself at the moment am playing with a mod called ROM that changes the way you play oblivion from the roots up, this appeals to me, for though I know the story, I have to really live it now. Why did I download it, the author wrote a beautiful pdf, explaining his reasoning, his PASSION for writing the mod, that was enough for me to uninstall many mods to try out his vision.

Again in this example Hammerfell, apart from contents list, what is it about, it was created with passion I trust, and I'll download it as I have discovered one of it's makers, of whom I have respect for, there for trust is also important. How as a new author to build that trust, I think you need a history, or a team, people like to feel a person has developed too, they have their story and that is fascinating too. This can also be used in advertising the mod.

Ultimately in my opinion passion and story rule, pretty graphics and gimmicks only last so long. Today in Shout was mentioned RST by DarkRider, I knew nothing of this project till then, but I asked for a link, the passion from others was there, I followed, and the quality was there to SEE, I shall be supporting this mod and spreading the word. Why I feel passionate about it.

Oh I have gone on long...perhaps because of some thing...begins with a P

Edited September 13, 2010 by Glimiril

[Vouivre]

Having only a small number(threeish?) mods released none of them earth shattering under my belt I'm still very new to the whole modding community. Here I've gotten enough support to keep me going on these endeavors, unlike in the official forums where you get shoved aside almost immediately. Hence why really my releases will be dominantly here as will news. I can say that i am truly humbled, for Varlasel to be translated into German. I was not expecting it in the least, the community there is just as kind as TESA is. Varlasel delivered (mostly) what it showed. A massive home totaling seven cells, with some nice small additions. I plan on expanding it by bringing Memoria as an addition, but it's probably easiest to avoid that and have them as separate mods. I have a small cottage(from the CS basics class) as well.

Ultimately it seems those whom have vetted their names with numerous releases, which became popular get first dibs with popularity. Of course also new projects that come out of the blue can gain a phenominal level of interest, because it is something different. It's the community itself which makes modding exceptionally difficult for new people. They're surrounded by so many mods, that it brings to question, well what can I do? Everything I want to do, has already been done. I've found myself with that position many many times over, to the point I've thought about walking away before I even start. It's been exceptionally difficult, when you see this mod get recognition and that one get it. Then you have yours, get nothing and pushed way back to page 10 of the forums, this is disheartening as either it's so busy no one catches it, or just no one cares figuring it's another wannabe modder, who tackles big projects and never finishes. I took on Varlasel, a behemoth of a home, and finished it with a release. I could definitely improve upon it, to levels that would astound me. But I'm moving on with things bigger and more grand than prior mods, I take every experience as a learning one and just take that extra step no matter if it could lead me into a pitfall or to success.

Dedication, tenacity, patience are three things that would help new modders, as well a creativity and a lot of luck, to come up with something that catches the eye. Remember, with mods coming out all the time, and people with a reputation I'm sure going through the lesser known mods, yours will be found and it could incite a wave of popularity. Personally I don't know if I want the fame that others have or not. Of course being known in the community helps you in other ways as well. Especially if you need help in future projects most likely people would be willing to help, especially if they see how you are and the projects you created have performed.

I have mixed feelings on the modding community, and I'm still very well new and have yet to find my niche in the scene. Someday maybe I'll find my place, until then I'll experiment.

[Critterman]

I think word of mouth can really get a mod's popularity up. I find out about most of the big mods from people here and on other ES related sites talking about them rather than actually seeing their WIPz thread on the BGS forums. None of my mods get talked about that much because a) they don't have cool special effects b) they are largely gameplay changes instead of adding pretty new content c) I speak mainly English. A and B are pretty obvious but C might not be...

My theory is that mods in languages primarily not in English get a little boost because people are more likely to talk about them. This is because the people that can speak that non-english language feel like they are let in on a secret and want to tell all of their friends, so they start their own thread on the BGS forums saying "look what I found!" and people see that and think "well that must be a good mod because people other than the mod author are commenting on how good it is". It helps to get opinions other than the mod author's. Plus, everyone knows Germans are so gosh darned productive, so there was hardly any doubt that they could finish a TC.

Of course, that's only a theory, but it could explain why Nehrim was so popular.

[Dane]

I always wanted to know how the Japanese Community is because it seems really big and promising too bad I don't understand JP

[DarkRider]

I think what you have to look at is the speculation factor. Forumers love to speculate, nibble at tidbits of info, boast their opinions of what might or might not be forthcoming on a new project. These debates and speculations add up to a lot of attention, press, and thread chat. If a thread is well presented, with lots of info, pics, and regular updates, I think they feel there's nothing to speculate on. My project has been in dev in the public eye for 2.5 years, I started and run TESA which is one of the leading up and coming ES fansites, I've been interviewed in BethBlog, but my thread still gets only a rare "Looks nice" once and awhile.

I think as modders, and especially true of modders on large projects who are more susceptible to the long silence echoing back in your threads, you have to develop an inner strength to persevere regardless of the level of support or attention your thread receives. I've had some dark times in RST's development, lost major chunks of work, lost contributors, lost support, but if you want to release, you have to go on. If not for yourself, then persevere for that one voice in your thread who did say "Looks good, I'm watching." because even if they aren't cheerleading all the way, they are watching and they are hoping you succeed, If you focus only on the attention you are not receiving, you dishonor the people who did comment, you invalidate their voices. Focus on them instead and you will never want for support.

[Vouivre]

So basically the more obscure and vague the thread/mod comes across as, the more enticing and exciting it is. Which means the more people want it?

[Critterman]

I still feel there has to be some sort of media (preferably a video) to gain any kind of interest. Making a WIPz thread with the obscure and vague description saying "Hi, I'm making a TC" isn't going to cut it. I think we can all learn from the game companies and how they release a teaser trailer and then let everyone speculate about it, then come out with all of the details later with the release; that way you can get people talking even before the release. Same thing can be done with mods, have a small little topic, with an enticing name and don't mention anything but the bare-bones of what you are creating with a really awesome teaser video. Though, all of that work wouldn't be worth it for small mods, just the big ones that need public support. I think THAT would really get people talking, and we all know people talking about your mod is a good thing (usually).

[DarkRider]

So basically the more obscure and vague the thread/mod comes across as, the more enticing and exciting it is. Which means the more people want it?

Not at all, because the opposite is true too. Mods with not enough information/media are usually attacked by the community and blown off as vaporware by big plans modders. The real answer is there is no magic formula for what makes one mod/thread popular over another. It's really just a lightning strike of different factors every time and it's not something you can recreate no matter how well you plan. The solution is to not worry about it and just do what you're going to do, regardless.

[Witty]

This is developing into a very interesting read. Some of the comments above are very informative and will no doubt be of interest to numerous members.

As mentioned by Dark above and from my own modding experiences, the ability to persevere regardless of the amount of support or attention you receive is imperative.

The most important point I would like to make is, at all times, no matter how disheartened you feel, you must embrace and enjoy the process of creating, discussing and releasing your mod.

Websites such as TESA are blessed with very proficient and motivated people who love to play and mod TES games. However, their most important attributes are generosity and loyalty. Members want your mod to succeed! Always remember that! Just because your mod has been download by very few people and your thread contains very few comments, does not mean that your mod or ideas are of poor quality. In fact, you should take great pleasure from each download and any discussion relating to your mod. Why? Because more often than not, you are improving a players gaming experience.

I have not answered any of the questions asked above but I feel that some people here get dispirited when their thread or mod doesn’t receive the attention they think it deserves.

Great discussion peeps!

[Lady_Nerevar]

I'll answer the posts in detail later (sometime between tea and drawing Angelina Jolie), but I just wanted to say that I'm not worried nor am I discouraged I'm just interested in the social dynamics of modding, and how all the little decisions we make influence the community's perception of mods.

Vouivre: Indeed, the BSF is harsh to new modders. Its also harder coming into it later, because, as you've said, a lot of things have been done. I think TESA is a wonderful place to get started specifically because its a smaller, more tightly knit community.

Critterman: I agree, though I don't know exactly how much it helps. There does seem to be a lot of interest in the community whenever non-English mods are presented. On the other hand, only a very limited number of foreign mods get advertised to English audiences, and it would make sense that only the best of the best make the cut. In other words, we're likely not seeing any mediocre foreign mods (which in turn could be creating the illusion that foreign = better).

The question now becomes "is any of this a problem?" In other words, is it worth investing time into strategies to help mods and modders get the attention they deserve?

[Arthmoor]

Well, I'm not sure how much experience I've had with the whole obsession vs non-obsession. So I'll try and go through this as best I can figure from my own perspective as a player.

Nehrim is something of an anomaly, and I'll admit I don't quite get it since all anyone's had up to a few weeks ago was an obscure German website with some trailers and screenshots, plus some WiP threads on the BGS forum that never even made it to the 200 post limit. Given the large number of other TC's that have been talked about and never materialized, one would have thought the community would be jaded about this one too, except they weren't. The fact that they delivered after 4 long years doesn't explain it. It just means they're the only TC that has. Maybe there's some magic here, maybe they found the right mix of teasers and advertising, I don't know.

With Hammerfell, I can't say for sure, but I strongly suspect that people are skeptical. I've seen the TR stuff mentioned on and off over the years, and I've seen how people keep saying nothing will come of it. A lot of folks were waiting breathlessly for some of it in Morrowind even and are STILL waiting to this day. I am aware that something the size of Hammerfell or Skyrim or Morrowind take a long time to complete, and may as well be TC scale since whole provinces are a lot of space, but the perception continues to be "but they don't have to build EVERYTHING, why is it taking so long". I've also gotten some sense from the lack of attention your thread got that people are looking at this and wondering why it's taken this long just to get to an incomplete alpha release. I will admit, I had some of the same thoughts about the length of time you guys have been working on it vs the amount that is out now. I'd be willing to wager if your alpha had hit the download sites with an equivalent amount of content to Elsweyr that folks would be going crazy for it.

Elsweyr came out of nowhere with a lot of highly detailed area done, many NPCs done, working weather, landscaping, cities, the whole bit. It may be lacking in a lot of quests, but when it hit the ground running, people got excited. You can go there and spend a considerable amount of time wandering around and soaking in the scenery. There's also a major draw in the fact that it exists in the main worldspace. I'll freely admit that's one of the big selling points for me is being able to cross in from anywhere on the map.

Onra's heightmaps are also generating a great deal of buzz, and even though most of the projects that will depend on them are nowhere near the level of Elsweyr, people are drawn to the idea that they'll be able to explore the whole of Tamriel all on the same map.

That said, I suspect now that you've got something tangible people can see and feel, there will be greater interest. That greater interest will probably translate into people wanting to lend a hand to help things along.

In my own experience, I've got a mix of both issues. Some of the projects I maintain are wildly popular, others barely a peep.

Open Cities for instance has gained quite a following since I took over. Texian and godhugh both did an awesome job with it, but their initial releases were still marred by bugs and an undeserved reputation for lagging peoples' games. It's taken literally the last two years to overcome most of that. It still comes up, and yes, it still bugs me to an extent that people are quick to blame it for stuff, but I've tried to just not let it bother me anymore.

By contrast, most of my villages have very small followings. Despite boatloads of comments from people who love them to death, they just don't enjoy the same kind of wild popularity. That's fine by me. I went into those with the full realization that village lovers are a niche market. I did expect a bit more than I've got, but what I do see I'm grateful for and it keeps me interested enough to want to make more.

The one thing I was most surprised by was the huge outpouring for A Brotherhood Renewed. I went into that fully expecting it to see mediocre numbers and modest amounts of downloads. It was quite a surprise to see it have the rapid rise of popularity and support. So the team and I have something to be proud of there.

Here's to hoping that wasn't all a bunch of silly rambling

[Ysne58]

There are all kinds of ways to present something. Predicting beforehand, how well something will be received is next to impossible. If I'm in a really bad mood, I'm not as likely to look at anything in a positive way than when I am feeling halfway decent.

[Rowan]

There are several things that help turn me on to a mod:

A catchy or epic title

A well known author

A professional presentation (no spelling or grammatical errors, several good screenshots or videos, and clean documentation)

A good idea - something that will augment my enjoyment of the game or offer me new experiences

As far as becoming well known and respected I think there are two parts to it - posting and communicating a lot, and releasing quality work. Posts should be clean and intelligent.

[Lady_Nerevar]

A lot of folks were waiting breathlessly for some of it in Morrowind even and are STILL waiting to this day.

Sorry to single this out, but parts of TR for morrowind have been release years back. People are still waiting on other parts, yea, but its far from vaporware.

TR is actually a really interesting example. In the very early days, there was a vehement opposition to it - any thread mentioning it quickly devolved into flames. After that it was relatively quiet. We had our supporters, but there was no huge community following outside our own forums. However, once we released Telvannis everything sort of exploded, I'd say TR is now held as the community standard in many ways, and many teams are trying to emulate what it did.

Hammerfell is taking so damn long because we really messed some very basic stuff up early on. Its a pity, and something I regret, but we were really just trying to do our best (even though it ended up to come back and bite us in the butt). Nothing you can really do but move on

Your post does raise another 'good' thing to do: do an announcement more than a wip thread. It seems that if a mod starts with content (whether its Nehrim which unveiled with a teaser video and screenshots or Anequina which did a fullblown release) it understandably generates more excitement. So I guess its better to keep your early stuff private.

By the way, thanks to everyone who has contributed so far This is exactly the sort of discussion I wanted to have, and its been very enlightening.

[Rowan]

So I guess its better to keep your early stuff private.

That's an interesting point, some advice that I should probably heed.

step by step guide to a blockbuster release:

1. 
   
   
2. communicate with fellow players and modders - a lot - make some friends and learn from others failures and success
   
3. learn construction set basics - release mods using the skills you've learned
   
4. learn more difficult modding skills - release more mods using those skills
   
5. begin working on your dream project by your lonesome and create something substantial
   
6. make a WIP thread and post some screenies and a basic plan - explain as necessary, but don't reveal too much - you want to create feeling of mystery around the mod. Why download it if you already know what happens? You want to start off with a bang to get people interested and motivated - to show that you can actually accomplish something.
   
7. create a separate forum exclusively for the development of your mod
   
8. create a website exclusively for the mod and post your teasers and screenies there.
   
9. start recruiting a team
   
10. work your butt off for as long as it takes - stay dedicated and don't rely on others to get it done for you - but guide and motivate the team because they are an important asset and they've volunteered their time to help you.
    
11. continue to post teaser screenies and vids that don't reveal too much of the plot or full scope of the mod - the idea is keep people interested
    
12. before release, make a decent trailer and take some quality screenies. post them up while you polish the mod and playtest the heck out of it.
    
13. release! give support and take comments - fix and release as necessary
    

[Vouivre]

I think that ultimately it plays to study the community before you get into modding. What is there a surplus of, what is there very little of and why. For example while lurking through ORE, Nexus and other sites for houses I discovered a few things before I began my modding. See, I'm not just a lifelong gamer(literally 21 years out of 26 years living) I'm also in college to make games for a career(words I'd never thought I'd mutter in my life), so I've learned somethings both from experience, but also an academic standpoint. I'll try to break things down from what i've seen.

Bodymods

Everyone Loves aesthetics, make your female characters beautiful(even if you love nudity, your game enjoy it) and male characters look better. There is plenty of female body mods out there, so the demand for them isn't high, unless it's to make them look "better". Male however sees very little action, it's predominantly ruled by Roberts. If you're skilled in anatomy and art, good place to tinker with is here.

Utilities

Always useful always in demand, and forever updating, if you can make something that takes the best of everything into one unit, and works without bugs and seamlessly. You're golden, this is what I could be doing, but I do not know python, and my C++ skills are lacking. a good challenge

Overhauls

TIE, OOO, MMM, FCOM the big names for the major overhauls, then we have Midas magic, and Fearsome Magicka(for magic overhauls) We have overhauls covering just about everything, pure combat and magic has been covered nicely, overall gameplay, and immersion has been done nicely as well, naturally room for improvement like anything. One would be hard pressed to do an overhaul that's worthwhile here, don't be discouraged. Stealth still could use some help. Research here helps.

Quests

Bread and butter for Oblivion, from companion mods, to huge quests and overhauls(mage guild, fighters guild DB they all got something done to them). Creativity and good scripting for quests is key, add some voice dialog with a compelling story and scenery, and you could be well on your way to a new career. I think I can say safely that we can always use new good quests. Things to take awhile to do, complex ones but enjoyable as well. Adding little key features in like moral responces and you could in theory have an excellent mod that everyone wants just because it's something different. I'd suggest hunting the forums to see what's lacking in this area.

Weapons/Armor/anything to be modelled/textured

Resources, things to add into a game via quests or other means, custom items is a rare skill to pull of nicely. And very rare does it become a phenomenon such as the lich king armor(only cause of Wow players, but it looks nice too) do things get huge. Unless you got ideas and or skills it'd take a lot of work to gain any solid credence here. Still if it is pulled off, it may help significantly. In any mod resources are your friend.

Homes

This actually is where I started modding from, having played the Player's House mod in the IC that I got from ORE, I decided that i want to build a nice home to call my own. Aranmathi, a very nice ayleid home showed me what something large scale could look like. I've enjoyed the mod completely while I used it, but again I wanted my own home. Something that I think could fit in lore wise, but also a touch of what I wanted. Call it an ego trip but, I wanted something big. Varlasel exceeded my expectations all around, I may just reinstall it, and tinker around with it, to make it more personal. Something that I can personally enjoy even more. It is here that a bit of study came to bear fruit. On ORE there is not a lot of ayleid homes that I personally saw an interest in, So I decided what any modder did, if there is something you do not like. Make it yourself. I thought, well I could just make something simple and be done with it. No, it grew into a behemoth, and when I first released it, it actually had a lot of popularity in terms of downloads, then I discovered an odd bug. So I took it down, (more out of personal embarrassment) and worked on fixing it. I re-uploaded it, still there's some odd bugs in it, that need work but I'll go back to them later on. Long story short, I did research, what was there a lot of, and not a lot of out there, that I could enjoy building and using. Ayleid ruins was the answer, they hold a majesty all their own, and truly seen when you use the "clean" ruin look. My second mod, aside from the cottage (very enjoyable to do actually.. simple small and rustic) was Memoria, my dimensional home. Taking a page from lemunde's ideas of dimensional homes, I tried my hand at it, and created something unique. I'm quite pleased with it actually, and may expand upon my dimensional homes for something quick and simple.

World Spaces

This seems to be a huge test in the ability of a modder. You have to create a new worldspace from scratch, landscaping, painting and then cluttering the land. Small scale this isn't a huge feat. However large scale like an island, or a whole new worldspace, like The size of Lands End, Elsweyr, and others, the work increases exponentially, as does the stress fatigue and many other things which discourage many. I am attempting a worldspace completely on my own, using what few skills I have, resources i collected and a lot of time. A worldspace is a rare mod, not many are out there, and fewer still are actually big enough to warrent attention. I personally want to create a place that is full of beauty. a screenshot haven, with that I have to compromise many features. Lag for performance, or visual appeal for a hit to the frame rate. Overall i think anything along these lines is the absolute most difficult thing to do.

[Vince]

Although I have a different take than most here, I agree with Rowan that a well thought out RELz post or description with no spelling errors is important. No matter what type of mod it is, most want something reliable and reasonably bug free. If there are spelling errors and half a dozen careless errors in the description, can you expect better than that from the mod itself?

Although I'm playing in a small pond of house mods, almost all near the top of the list are very good. At least for house mods, with sites like Oblivion's Real Estate, the word gets around. As an example, one of the fastest rising house mods is Korana's Shadowcrest Vineyard. That mod has a lot of original content and it's clear that a very large effort went into creating it.

So, it seems to me that some spin (including screen shots or video) does help the popularity of a mod, but the long term growth and popularity is largely proportional to the quantity and quality--and creativity--of the effort that went into producing it.

[Dane]

it's starting to become an amazing read, but (I forgot who said it) What makes a good idea? is it something loved by the community or loved by yourself?

[Rowan]

A good idea is something that satisfies a demand in the community while simultaneously fulfilling your own creative desires.